For those considering a college education, perhaps you should think again. Thoughts?

This is from the Journal of Higher Education.





“Also, the past advantage of college graduates in the job market is


eroding. Ever more students attend college at the same time as ever


more employers are automating and sending offshore ever more


professional jobs, and hiring part-time workers. Many college


graduates are forced to take some very nonprofessional positions, such


as driving a truck or tending bar.





How much do students at four-year institutions actually learn?





Colleges are quick to argue that a college education is more about


enlightenment than employment. That may be the biggest deception of


all. Often there is a Grand Canyon of difference between the reality


and what higher-education institutions, especially research ones, tout


in their viewbooks and on their Web sites. Colleges and universities


are businesses, and students are a cost item, while research is a


profit center. As a result, many institutions tend to educate students


in the cheapest way possible: large lecture classes, with necessary


small classes staffed by rock-bottom-cost graduate students. At many


colleges, only a small percentage of the typical student's classroom


hours will have been spent with fewer than 30 students taught by a


professor, according to student-questionnaire data I used for my book


How to Get an Ivy League Education at a State University. When


students at 115 institutions were asked what percentage of their class


time had been spent in classes of fewer than 30 students, the average


response was 28 percent.





That's not to say that professor-taught classes are so worthwhile. The


more prestigious the institution, the more likely that faculty members


are hired and promoted much more for their research than for their


teaching. Professors who bring in big research dollars are almost


always rewarded more highly than a fine teacher who doesn't bring in


the research bucks. Ernest L. Boyer, the late president of the


Carnegie Foundation for the Advancement of Teaching, used to say that


winning the campus teaching award was the kiss of death when it came


to tenure. So, no surprise, in the latest annual national survey of


freshmen conducted by the Higher Education Research Institute at the


University of California at Los Angeles, 44.6 percent said they were


not satisfied with the quality of instruction they received. Imagine


if that many people were dissatisfied with a brand of car: It would


quickly go off the market. Colleges should be held to a much higher


standard, as a higher education costs so much more, requires years of


time, and has so much potential impact on your life. Meanwhile, 43.5


percent of freshmen also reported "frequently" feeling bored in class,


the survey found.”

For those considering a college education, perhaps you should think again. Thoughts?
As a teacher (obviously experienced college) I can say that 95% of professors outside of the actual education department...general studies...were HORRID teachers. If elemenatry and high school teachers taught like that our nation would crumble. But they are also very intelligent people...they just arn't teachers.





One of my education professors nearly lost his job before he had it when he told the university that a BS in education was just that...BS. That there was little Science behind the actual act of teaching (anyalizing data and whatnot...probably) that those wanting to be teachers would be just as good if they didn't attend college.


While I agree to a large extent, having that background to rely on, the ideas I was given and theories I learned have helped me. But I learned more about teaching in the first 6 months of teaching than I did in 4 years of sitting in a classroom. My own style grealy pervails, but college does help. In my opinion there is no such thing as useless knowledge.





EDIT-As a teacher we are constantly taking more classes, going to workshops and conferences, continuing our professional development and knowledge of how kids learn. We have to keep up with things or we will fall behind. I have not been out of college for more than 1 1/2 and I have already had more than 150 hours of professional development of some kind and will have more than 50 more over the Summer. Frankly I love to learn and am frustrated when I don't know something (my quote is "I'll look it up")...I hope to pass this down to my students. It seems rather lazy to accept your mind as is at the age of 18.
Reply:I am glad I didn't spend too much time in college and went out into the workforce. I now have a good paying job and things are going well in my life. College was so frigging superficial.....Camping and bowling were mandatory classes, for example........
Reply:It's better than work and at least you learn something!





*hey Tracey I guess your not not a Harvard, Yale or Oxford grad :-D
Reply:Oops, too late! I'm just about to graduate.





Why didn't you tell me this four years earlier and saved me a lot of time and money?
Reply:I learned plenty; I enjoyed it, and the skills I gained are helping me in my career.
Reply:Best thing I ever did :-)
Reply:It depends on the college. I have a friend who is a professor at a "diploma mill" (not by choice...professorships are hard to get). She's not allowed to fail anyone. She shares snippets from her students' papers with me. The students are illiterate and frighteningly ignorant.





Harvard, Yale and Oxford grads will always get get great jobs.





* Johno, no I went semi-Ivy League (call it "the fern league"). My grades and SATs were good enough for Ivy League (though not good enough for full-ride scholarships) but my bank account was most definitely not.
Reply:I've got my college education and I'm glad I did. I'm going to be a teacher, so it's not like I had much choice. I went to a state college, so my education wasn't the best, but I think it'll do.





Why are there two Traceys on here right now? The clone still hasn't left I see.
Reply:yet what choice does one really have? What kinds of jobs do you have without a degree?





lol will tell you college is a piece of cake...and BS. Sorry but it's true.
Reply:how come people even bother majoring in "film studies" or even english, any liberal art majors. of course your not going to be guarenteed a job because you degree is bullshit, any moron could have one...


and i could not agree more that teachers who are praised for their research are not necassarily good teachers. they feel that teaching is a waste of their time, they want to be in the lab.


and state schools are ridiculously crowded, and that results in a shitty education..try learning organic chemistry in a classroom with over 500 people in it..





bitter? yeh this college i went to ruined my life for now


and i dont mean bullshit, your right any degree is better than none, degrees show that a person knows how to stick with something, persevere and all that...but i have known so many people who come out of school with a liberal arts degree and dont do anything with it. its there faut you should look at the job market before you major
Reply:This all depends on the college. My university, for example, does not allow for more than 30 students in one class. We do not have any lecture halls and professors have to have listed office hours. That's one of the things I love about my university--its small classroom and heavy student/professor interaction.





I do agree about research professors. This is mostly done in Ivy league colleges, actually. Seems odd but the more you pay, the more chances your professor is going to push their own research and do far less teaching.





Just another reason why I want to be a public university professor. I would rather teach than do research any day.





Oh, and this "survey" is bogus. A "national survey?" Its impossible to do a national survey that accurately generalizes back to the study population. It doesn't even say which universities were sampled. Public? Private? Both? And in what percentage?
Reply:anonymous: you sound bitter. who are you to say all liberal art degrees are "bullshit"?





i for one think that ANY college education is better than none. lets face it, unless you get lucky, you're not going to get a good, progressive job without some kind of college education. the thing is, it may not be the job you want. for example, i am finishing up a (gasp!) professional writing/ journalism degree. i know i may not land an amazing job exactly in my field right away, but i could probably land a community resource job, or any kind of public relations position. i was told a few years ago that employers love English majors because they assume they can read, write and communicate well.
Reply:what volume issue is this from??





EDIT:


You stated that this was from the Journal of Higher Ed and clearly (from the link you sent) this was from the Chronicle and was not written by a researcher. The Journal is a reputable publication. The Chronicle is not peer reviewed. It was an opinion piece.





The problem is that many high schools cater to these kids and think its some kind of honor if more of their students go on to college. What I get are students not willing or able to do college level work. They think "A" stands for average.





Of course 45% of freshmen are bored. College is not MTV or a video game. It can be tedious to assimilate facts and put them into a reasonable framework.
Reply:"Caveat emptor" (Let the buyer beware) also applies to colleges and universities. There are good instructors and bad instructors, good classes and classes that are a waste of time, and degrees that will be more directly useful to your post-education career than others.





If you don't want to end up saying "you want fries with that" don't take a degree in Film Studies. Or, be prepared to take another degree after that one. There are still many, many useful endeavors in colleges and universities.





I would suggest looking at the sciences, engineering or perhaps a medical degree if you want something that has a higher likelihood of being in demand. Depending on your aptitude, of course.





Edit: Eh, fair enough. I'm going out to drink some goat blood anyways.
Reply:Despite what some people say, don't necessarily look to major in engineering, science, or in other technical applications. Those lead to often high paying but unstable employment and many of those jobs are being outsourced or becoming obsolete. What's worse is that many American companies are bringing in foreigners on H-1b visas to do those same jobs for only a fraction of what Americans earn. If you are going to major in something, make sure you can do it and it's something you actually like doing. Also, make sure it's in a field that is not as prone to becoming obsolete or being outsourced.
Reply:I don't know about this. I treasure my undergraduate education and I feel completly satisfied with it and it's cost. I would not take it back for anything. I can't speak for anyone else, but I truly believe in the power of education and what it CAN do.





I went to a junior college so I was not subject ot the 300+ student lecture halls at University. My lowever division was completed by teachers who had their Ph.D, ABD, or had their M.A. I believe I got an excellent education. I would agree that the lecture halls don't harbor thought-they are desined more like highschool class rooms. I did have to take 2 lower division classes once I transferd and it was a joke. I knew more about the subject (RLST) than the graduate student who taught our discussion class. But he was studying economics and had only 1 RLST class throughout his education.





Getting a college degree is no guarantee that you will get a job. Of course, that highly depends on what you study. My friend just got her Pharm.D. a couple years ago and she was hired by Kaiser before she even graduated making over $80,000 a year. Of course I studied history and religious studies which basically leaves teaching, museum work, library work, or archiving for they city as my job options.





An education is only as good as what you get out of it. If you have no interest in being there, than it will not be beneficial to you. If you enjoy learning and the exchange of ideas, than you will thrive. College is not for everyone. And I argue that a junior college and a state school can give you a very good education-rivaling that of any Ivy League school. But you have to let it.





Edit:


For certain types of work you have to have a degree, so maybe more people should think of their career goals before going to college. Teachers, doctors, lawyers, engineers...these types of jobs require knowledge and a college education is the only way to get this. If you want to be a construction worker or manager for a retail company-then of course you don't need a degree to do that.